>"So your main argument is that anything you are ignorant about must be god.<"

so is your argument (Swarm) that what you're ignorant (ignore) must not be or exist until we figure it out?
yet "we will not and can not know"??

and yet you say there is no need for A god, yet could it be plausible that "that Self " you mentioned

which you say is "cooperative self interest" be A god?... which is "micromanaging" (y)our existence?

>"Lack of "higher" intelligence...how do ignoramiums deal with it?"<

by using words that sound like they are calling others ignorant

and what does "ignorance" and "authority " ... have to do with "anthropomorphizing nature" Hmm

i think your god intelligence has answered the question for us

"fantasy scientifically".... or science fiction...you don't know, but yet you say it's "fantasy"... Hmmm

now isn't that a fallacy...?

>"Lack of "higher" intelligence...how do ignoramiums deal with it?"<"

by spiritually growing up and opening our hearts ...it too has an intelligence

we can know natures IQ, god intelligence, by way of the heart and love ...

science can't tell us about love, but doesn't mean it doesn't exist

the GAps are like the silence between the notes of music, it makes the music

so everything we have (our brain structures etc) are all a consequence of them being directly involved in being 'useful' to our survival from an evolutionary point of view?

GRIM so how do you explain your theory in relation to original post about the east Australian Mallee fowl ?

ok LAST ONE... ;-p

Deepak Chopra interview on Larry King Live regarding God and the Tsunami, 1/7/05

KING: Deepak Chopra, how can you have faith when you see something like this?

DEEKAPK CHOPRA, AUTHOR: Hi, Larry. In fact, your faith increases, Larry.

Because faith is trusting that God is all the forces, the forces of creation, the forces of protection and the forces of destruction. This is an opportunity for us to transcend our religious differences, our ethnic boundaries, and create a new humanity which is based on love, sharing, compassion, giving.

And we are seeing that. The militaries of the world are getting together to bring relief. People are losing their differences in Sri Lanka. The Buddhists and the Hindus and the Muslims are getting together. This is our opportunity.

You know in historical traditions, in religious traditions, God rained on the earth for 40 days. And from that came Noah's Ark and the creation of a new humanity. Can we create a new humanity that is not based on militarism ethnocentrism, racism, bigotry, hatred, and prejudice?

KING: Deepak, if he loves us why does he bring us such pain that could be prevented?

CHOPRA: I think, Larry, one of the problems right now is we keep referring to God as him and his. We have a very sexist, male identity that we've given to God. I agree with Michael Lerner, that our idea of God, our concept of God, our experience of God, changes as we evolve. I think the idea of sin and punishment is very, very primitive. And we have to ask ourselves right now, are we going to choose between sin and compassion? Compassion is the way to go right now.

And you know, there's lots of evidence, even scientific, that the earth is a living organism. The gaia (ph) hypothesis. Is it possible that our consciousness and the turbulence in our consciousness has anything to do with the turbulence in nature? Michael Lerner just referred to that.

One of the very interesting things that happened with the tsunami was, no animal died. The elephants. The hares. The rabbits. The birds. They were so tuned in to the forces of nature that they escaped. They ran. Some of the elephants broke their chains and ran to the high level mountainous area where the tidal waves could not reach. We have lost that connection. Is there a way that we can collectively transcend to a level of consciousness where we see that the turbulence in our collective mind, possibly, is inseparable from the turbulence in nature? Because we are part of nature.

KING: Is it hard, Deepak Chopra, to stay up? In other words, is it hard to ground that feeling of good will when you see a tragedy like this?

CHOPRA: No, it in fact helps you ground that feeling of good will, Larry. You have to remember, as again, Rabbi Lerner said something very profound. The actual figure is 40,000 children are dying every day of preventable causes. 23 million people have died since World War I due to war and related violence. Right now there are 35 wars going on in our world.

This is an opportunity for us to say, the cataclysmic events in nature are so big, but the inhumanity of man to man is even bigger. And can we learn from this, that at least there are certain things that we can do to make this a better world? What can we do? This is our opportunity to go beyond our religious differences because of what's happening. It brings out the essential goodness of man.

CALLER: The question is, do you have any advice as to the masses, exactly how to keep this a little more balanced?

KING: Good question.

CHOPRA: It's a very good question. You know, the idea here is that if we quiet the turbulence in our collective mind and heal the rift in our collective soul, could that have an effect on nature's mind, if nature has a mind? The gaia hypothesis says nature does have a mind, that the globe is conscious.

So a critical mass of people praying or a critical mass of people collectively engaging in meditation could conceivably, even from modern physics point of view, through non-local interactions, actually simmer down the turbulence in nature. And there are precedents for this in all the religions. That when you pray, that you quieten your mind, that you go into deep silence, you change the way nature behaves. That it's not a cause/effect relationship; it's the inseparability of one consciousness that manifests itself in the diversity of creation.

KING: Deepak, do you doubt?

CHOPRA: No, Larry, I don't doubt. But I do feel sorry sometimes that we have allowed God to be hijacked by religious dogma. For example, right now on the show there aren't any women. You know, why is that? Every time we do a show on God, religion, it's always us males representing these different traditions.

We need to realize that when we share our suffering, out of that comes compassion. And out of compassion comes love and understanding. And from that comes healing. As long as we stick to "my" version of God, we're going to have problems. I say that right on the show

What do you think are problematic about any of these?

Bioluminescence has many uses and occurs for different purposes in many deep sea fish, different behaviours in combination with variable behaviours lead to different 'tools'. No mystery there.

Same with mouth-cleaning fish, a pair of behavioural evolutions in tandem.

All of these occur because there's survival advantage to them.

Neither your ignorance nor that there remain unexplained phenomena means god.

Flagellar Motor
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/bv.fcgi

Once one of the "inexplicables" which was used as an argument from ignorance by the ignorant, we know know quite a bit about how it works and where it came from evolutionarily speaking.

read to your heart's content: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/bv.fcgi

*************************Let’s imagine a fish *****************

And there in lies the failure point in your entire message.

You enter a room and want to talk about intangibles like the things you imagine and stuff you tell yourself that you sense.

Then you demand rational scientific responses to non rational things.

Look it's really vbery simple.
You can't prove or disprove God using the scientific method. God as it is posited exists outside of time space and dimension. God is infinite.
Nothing in the physical realm has been proved to be infinite. This simply because humans have nothing that can measure infinity.

We talk about the infinite reaches of space but, no one has ever been outside this solar system - let alone to the infinite reaches. We observe light and radio waves as they drift to us here on earth and calculate distances and other things but as far as knowing that space is infinite: It's just a good hypothesis. For all any one knows there is a lip to the universe outside of which is a titan child's tea set.

But, I'm not betting on the tea set.

I wrote: "In the case of humans, we created neural boutons that provide neural shortcuts..."
===========
...we CREATE boutons...

Hey MC. Good to see you again.

Termites and ants are the source of the foundational bacteria you need to make yogurt and kifir They either gather or generate the dozens of anti fungal, anti bacterial, and anti viral organisms that go into good home spun yogurt making.
I posted a video of a Turkish peasant woman tearing an ant hill apart for the bacteria on the eggs - and then using 'em to make yogurt on the Kifir making tribe

Interestingly if you are in the wilderness and in serious need a topical anti bacterial you can use ants. Either dig up a nest and use the soil from inside or find the eggs and roll them around or just let the ants crawl all over the wound dressings you plan to use.